Legend: Legacy of the Dragons Forum

@ zAquisgran
@ lol666

Thanks for answers.

Look, these are the actual prices of these boxes, and not the level-boosting players involved

http://warofdragons.com/artifact_info.php?artikul_id=18931 ~ 1,2g
http://warofdragons.com/artifact_info.php?artikul_id=18932 ~ 2,1g

Why the box that gives 15s more becomes 90s more expensive? With what nonsense (like demand-supply aspect) can you justify it now? What has changed in 2 days that suddenly silver boxes dropped in price by 70s and gold boxes are 15s more expensive? Since the content in them is IDENTICAL except for the 15s higher in the case of gold

I know economy, in fact, in college I did it quite thoroughly and I don't say it to brag - I'm just aware that this is not what this case is about. The point is that players cannot (or do not want to) understand that by working together they can achieve more. By sticking to collectively agreed prices, everyone will get an equal share of boxes fairly. Instead, players push prices up to 2x higher (which already causes losses instead of profit) as if they thought the higher price would magically double the number of boxes on the server. As a result, not only do they not earn money, but the boxes themselves become a dead product (only the seller gains), and the locksmith loses the most (especially the one who intends to increase the levels by them)

Again, this situation is NOTHING different from the vercide/rainbow fights with mobs. In both cases, the game allows the player to make a decision in which he respects the other player and does not interfere (cooperates), or he does not care and crudely joins every fight he has started and/or beats him mindlessly on the exchange for a change, starting thus a sick avalanche. If someone does not understand it, they simply do not want to understand it

It will never be rational that "gray boxes" from which you can take out 1.3g are on the market for 2g, "green boxes" that offer about 2g are also on the market for 2g, and for example "blue boxes" offering 2.3g are easy and willingly players sell even for 1, 7g. Just like it won't be normal to change the price of such a box by 75% in just a few days.

@ BeefyChowMein

1) Of course I'm going to buy them and benefit from it - and that makes me bad? Why, then, do not the rest who also do the same become "someone bad"?

2) In the very beginning, I wrote several times that it has the worst impact on locksmiths who start the game, or rather soon will need these boxes - they will have to pay extra for this profession due to a sick raising of prices, if they want to think about getting promotions quickly - supposedly so many times I wrote it outright, but you're making only the supposed negative things about me?

3) My comments are not "so heavily biased", I just plainly present the facts, the data, instead of throwing blank slogans that mean nothing in this topic. Why, among the next commentators (even you), no word refers to the merits and the questions I have repeatedly asked, about the logic of buying something worth 1.3g at a price of even 2.1g? You just keep silent about what is inconvenient, and by the way the fact - I only describe such a situation. So you even want to deny the facts? Fat

4) LOL! I understand evil eyes (for various reputations), professional resources (for various missions, reputations), but boxes? I have been playing for many years, I have been opening them for a very long time, but apparently I was wrong - give CONCRETE why do locksmiths buy boxes, if not for profit? I have shown that almost everyone who breaks through boxes nowadays put bids on those boxes for which they can't get promoted, so leveling up could not be their motive. So hard to understand that certain boxes ALWAYS drop certain resources (set by the game, not by me! ), the price of which is commonly known and stable? Cause-and-effect relationship, how could you want to buy something worth 1.35g for 2.1g and think it's okay? This someone would later have to sell salmon/amber from a box for 4-5s to make it justified - how often do you see such offers, if at all?

5) Let players break through the stock market, at auctions, when they urgently need missing inks or cents, they will probably be willing to pay more than players who are patiently buying to keep them in stock. The same is true for raw materials that players are mainly responsible for and value them based on their own "real" time spent harvesting them. And there are many simillar situations - it's quite normal. But the boxes? After all, it is an item with a specific content, including cash, and in a banal way you can estimate its value - why today silver boxes (lvl 120) are for 1.2g? Or rather it was in the morning, now they are already 1.3g? What, in a dozen or so hours, the prices of raw materials have changed? Yesterday there were these boxes of 2g, so you think that suddenly there was a crash of raw materials and they became 3 times cheaper than yesterday?

6) I would be a bit surprised, but I would understand players who try to raise the locksmith lvl on boxes by exchange, sometimes I see people who MOMENTLY break the prices - of course, they want to do it quickly, so they consciously overpay, which is always "something for something". The problem is, THIS situation is not such a "special momentary situation" after which a player of urgent needs disappears from the stock exchange - here we are talking about players who treat boxes as earnings (not a loss by definition) from the PROFESSION of a locksmith Shock! That the player wants to benefit and earn from his profession

7) Nominal value? And where did I tell about something like that? You make up crap about me and accuse me of "so heavily biased." But I will refer to such a teasing - I did not say in any case that the prices "on items" (those suggested by the game) are adequate to follow, but it's nice that you made it up yourself, less fun that you tell me that I wrote it somewhere. READ WITH UNDERSTANDING! I just want to point out that if you have about 1.3g and 20 amber inside, you can't do it favorably by buying boxes of 2.1g - don't you understand?

...Another person is talking nonsense about supply and demand in the context of items that themselves contain a certain amount of profession materials. On the other hand, it is not surprising that the sellers of boxes (you make money on it) enjoy the turnover of things, when a locksmith pays 2.1g for a box from which he will get a maximum of 1.75g ​​in real terms. It's funny, however, how you avoid the answers and give no details, no answers to the questions about the logic of placing the mentioned boxes at the given prices ...well, if I knew that I have no idea about something, I would probably also avoid the answer, but probably I would not take part in the discussion at all, instead of sprinkling ineffective generalities and nonsense on someone else's subject.

@ BeefyChowMein

Man, you say you feel sorry for 3min to read someone else's statement, but you can spend the same 3min to write a comment that does not bring anything to the matter, and yet offends the interlocutor. So, who are you, that you are allowed to do so? And at the same time you ask me who I am to have my own opinion that I am trying to share with others? Hypocrite?

You are either wrong or outright - you don't understand the essential difference:

1) You pay X, outbid someone's offer for Y, buy and/or sell whatever you want - BECAUSE YOU HAVE THIS POSSIBILITY, but not a necessity (you can even buy evil eyes for 5g, why? Just beacuse you have option and cash to do this),you can act without sense in any matter where mechanically (systemically) the game does not prohibit it, or you are not breaking the rules bravo, you reinvent the wheel... for 3 year olds
2) You buy an item at a certain and reasonable price (so it does not apply to exceptions - when you urgently need a certain amount and you do it for a moment, not permanently), I kind of make up these prices? NO - the price of the box depends on what may be inside, and the price is commonly known and quite stable (price differences up to ~20% are normal, but somehow we can determine that certain profession materials are worth ~2s and not 8s - true ?), if you understand the banality that a child would deal with, it's a step away from understanding that 20 profession resources for 2s gives 40s, another 1.25g in cash results in the contents of the box around 1.65g - and the fact that spending on it more than the aforementioned value, you will just be losing out on business, did you not get overwhelmed by it?

Experts who do not understand such fundamental differences will educate others about supply and demand Once some wise person told me that idiots are easy to recognize when they interfere with a topic they have no idea about... although it is his words, and not mine, but he was probably right

Well, okay expert, you've written a lot about whining and crying - if you've already stopped bleating, please indicate the difference between points 1 and 2 from this statement, and 3 and 4 which I post below:

3) You activate 10 blessings per hour and regularly join fights started by other players (rainbow), why? Because you can - BECAUSE YOU HAVE THIS POSSIBILITY because the game entitles you to do so, because even if you attack a mob that someone has already attacked, you will receive an adequate message, you can ignore it and attach it - thus causing a possible loss of this player, and without reaching the possible potential yourself (you waste your own blessings)
4) You understand that you are not alone in this world, you respect the other person and seeing that they are currently attacking mobs, you wait for your turn as agreed (kads), or you change mob / locations and go where they are available as a result of goodwill, both you benefit from it, because you extract the maximum potential from your blessings

PS Currently, I can (like everyone else) push the offer up and introduce a monopoly in this way, because people wanting to earn the most, most of the boxes will only sell to me
PS2 I explain that I do not want to bring it to this state, I care about EQUAL prices offered by all players, so that everyone willing to get the same/similar amount
PS3 By combining the above, I even consciously risk being sold to me less (although I will buy it at a lower cost), but at least it will be fair for everyone, so de facto I want the best for everyone (even at my own expense), especially those who will just raise locksmith lvl
PS4 I'm called on by monopolists & the sick system and perceived as if my opinion would lead to the worst, i.e. selling me all possible boxes
PS5 No wonder that locksmith act the way (title of topic), since more blunt/blind people behave identically and defend such obtuse behavior

I'm glad someone finally started to understand it. Of course, MasterYi is an excellent example it is even the quintessence of what I have been talking about for a long time - locksmith buying boxes can be divided into 2 logical ways of proceeding:
- getting the benefits of the contents of the box
- promotion of the locksmith lvl (usually quick and short, it carries a higher price)

With his comment, word for word, he confirmed what I said above (point 6 in message #25 for example), confirming that a player trying to expressly improve his level of a locksmith is able to temporarily pay more than others (and it's okay!), but he only does it until he reaches the set goal, because somehow later he does not care what the price of the item is, he does not intend to be interested in it anymore - and that's okay, I am talking about it from the beginning

Now we should ask - why would he want to buy the aforementioned 135lvl boxes at a price of ~1.8g?
- Is it the result of the fact that he somehow counted that such a cost will cause him not to do business (it will go to +-0), or possibly the loses will be small?
- Is it simply the other locksmiths buy at a certain price, so if he wants to encourage others to sell caskets to him, his offers must have higher price?

I suspect that it is the second reason, and if so, if the boxes were 2g each (as with magmars for several days), it would have to offer, for example, 2.4g to make its offer interesting. If so, why actually has it not crossed his mind now to pay as much as 2.4g? If I was wrong, why now in the post MasterYi proposed the price of 1.8g, and not 2.4g? It is trivial - because he wouldn't have to overpay that much, but he would have to if he wanted to do it with more expensive boxes (higher price, although they would still have the same valuable content!). The key is the fact that paying more for the box does not magically increase its contents, despite the fact that this is what "demand and supply experts" think

Finally, let's multiply the need to open, for example, 200 boxes before X locksmith lvls are achieved, and ask the player whether he prefers to spend 200x 1.8g [360g] or 200x 2.4g [480g] to get exactly the same [200 boxes]? The question of whether to have 120g or the sellers of the boxes will collect 120g more...

@ lol666

Sure, I paying attention to a fact, that a box with content for 1.65g, players buy even 2.1g. But it's so normal, and definitely it must be prank: lol: as I said before - we have lived to see the times when stupidity is glorified and thinking mocked...

After another 2 weeks without any meaningful answer, I decided to summarize the entries so far and present them in numbered lists by separate messages for easier reading.

The first list presents the 15 key points that I have touched upon throughout the thread. To how many of them were answers, thoughts… perhaps arguments that could prove me wrong, an attempt to explain a given situation, or simply answer for precise question that I asked? I saw some answers for points 4, 5 and 10 (the answer is "demand and supply" which are only general, and the discussed thread does not constitute value, because I have already proved that it is not about the demand and supply - demand and supply may have an impact on the price when at same moment several locksmiths who want to raise their prof level (I agree with it), although in the described cases I emphasized several times that this was not the case, because boxes with lvl 120/135 were bought by players who did not have no longer a chance to increase the locksmith lvl).

Then think about who is really wasting time (list with 10 points of nothing), since you avoiding 80% of the content/meaning of the topic, repeating empty slogans like "demand-supply" or "monopoly" without noticing that first is not about, and also that I’m trying to avoid the second. According to you, by spending my time, I do not contribute anything positive and I dare to lecture others, but you (who enter to my topic) read just few of my words and write off-topic nonsense, sometimes mocking or insulting me, and even lecturing me. After 2 weeks (with the exception of a few valuable messages) you put about dozen of messages and still have not answered even one specific question, and then you expect me to agree with your opinion, which you cannot and do not want to defend even with one word XD You do not care about a dozen key aspects that I mentioned, you say crap (which I can relate to out of respect, although I could ignore it), and after all you expect that I will hide and stop thinking, despite the fact that you accuses me of biasing

Talking about:
1) Temporarily breaking the offers of other players in order to efficiently and urgently buy a certain number of resources (usually a small amount)
2) Handicap of players, in the context of establishing stable prices of items (in case of boxes)
3) Situation in which 2 uncooperative players start buying boxes (with a content worth ~1.65g) for 1.2g, then each time breaking by 1s, they lead to a price of 2.1g and without learning, without drawing any conclusions they start the action all over again with 1.2g
4) Situation when the stock exchange can be without any offer for a specific box for half a day (informing that there is absolutely no pressure to get them), automatically denying that the dynamic change in prices results from the rational principle of supply and demand
5) In relation to the above, placing offers on such "unwanted" boxes (which the day before were supposedly so strongly desired by several players) at a price of ~20% lower than they were posted yesterday. Effect? About 15-20 boxes sold in just 3 hours. And then "yesterday's buyers" breakthrough my prices by 1s. So why did they beat me only by 1s, and not give thoughtless high prices like the day before and every previous day?
6) Encouraging players to post prices at mutually agreed and affordable prices that will be profitable for both sellers and buyers – so it’s still give chance and possibility of real earnings by profession, and also increasing the lvl of locksmith without spending too much cash.
7) Appreciation of players who are aware that selling something at a price lower by 1s will not make them poorer
8.) Comparison of mutual respect and compliance with the rules on the stock exchange, to proceed during hitting mobs on vercida/rainbow - indicating the similarities and dependence on the good will of players
9) Clarification that the sense of active purchase of boxes on the exchange by burglars is only in two cases (earning from the content or improving the lvl of the locksmith)
10) Reducing topic to „demand-supply” principle is wrong by definitione, because it ignores the fact that the content of the box is always the same (you can determine the average value of what is inside, because it is always one of the few commonly known options - this is a fact that locksmiths active on the stock exchange must know about)
11) Situation in which 2 locksmiths (unable to increase prof lvl from these boxes) buy 2 types of boxes with the same content (the only difference is that there are 15s more in golden), silver for 1.9g and golden for 1.86g… and 2 days later, the same players have offers for silver ~1.2g and golden for 2.1g
12) In relation to the above, the question is whether it is real (how often it happens) that the contents of these boxes (salmon, amber and heat flower) change their regular market value from 1.5-2s to even 8s? Such a change would justify such a colossal difference in the price of boxes within several hours
13) I asked for what other purpose (see point 9) the locksmith would be active on the stock exchange in order to outbid others and buy boxes?
14) Emphasizing several times the understanding for locksmiths who break (on 1-2 boxes) others because they do it temporarily to achieve the desired level of prof - they are fully justified, as one of the groups I wrote about earlier
15) Paying attention to avoiding responses to specific aspects that have been raised, the effect? Silence

What responses did I get, mainly from the most active/loudest players?
1) Dynamics of price changes - I gave the answer (yaa sure, the boxes changed their price based on the constellation of stars and moon, because the fact that prof resources have a fairly stable price has no effect, yhy)
2) Mocking idea of writing down a list of price of all things in the game – I gave the answer (why talk crap, when we can talk to each other, get along and respect each other? It’s simple)
3) In relation to the above, drawing attention that my thinking is *beep* and I would supposedly like to introduce a monopoly – I gave answer (my concept allows all interested parties to buy a similar (ideologically identical) number of boxes at the same cost, the question arises, do you understand what "monopoly" means? What I am talking about is just the opposite)
4) Off-topic nonsense with the slogan like "Nobody cares, belive me" – I gave answer (maybe right, that's probably why "mr nobody" puts answers here)
5) Empty slogan „Supply and demand” – I gave answer (pont 4, 5 and 10 from previous list)
6) „A wise man once told me, if you’re getting overbid, that’s because your price is too low” – XD so take your „wise man”, tell him to put offer 5g of evil eye, and then break his price by 1s… you will prove that this „wise man” wasn’t so smart at all, he just threw nonsense that fit his theory (he justifying his points, right?), and you was very gullible... well, unless you inform him that apparently his 5g for the evil eye was an discounted offer, bravo you
7) Topic with more than 20 words beyond mental capacity – so what is the forum for? Messages of max 20 words are more suitable for prv XD
8.) Few times -> Texts about being biased and „TLDR” – I gave the answers (am I biased and put too long messages? It’s true that I post long messages - did you notice at all why? Because I give arguments and examples every time, talkin about specific situations, not nonsense without justification. You publish short messages that are not related to the topic, avoid the merits and ignore what this post is about. Why do you speak up on a matter that you do not care about and/or you are unable to convey anything important?)
9) Surprise that I want to write this (taunts that the writer should be my third profession - but I'm biased, right?), a suggestion that I would do better if going hit mobs on vercida (well, holding the Q key for an hour does not require thinking - something you know that), writing about wasting my time – I gave answer (but you selectively read just few of my sentences and write off-topic nonsense - I understand that you don't waste your time when talking to me, but I’m only wasting? XD hypocrisy)
10) The nominal value of the item (the one shown next to the picture in „item info”) is, in my opinion, allegedly the market value – I gave answer (WHAT? XD until now I do not know where I said it, or something that would even indicate it... but yaa cool, probably it was just typical nonsense in which you are experts)